Is this dog aggressive?

Question

I am possibly seeking the help of a professional trainer. I recently acquired a 4 yr old field English Setter, named Jet, who was taken from a situation where he had been tied up outside for a few years. He was going to be a gun dog but turned out to be gun shy. He was not abused but probably neglected . He was taken in by a groomer who was planning to keep him unless she found a good home. Enter me.

I took Jet in about 10 days ago. He has been almost the perfect solution to our desire to be dog owners. He is housebroken and much more responsive to commands than I expected. He is crate trained. He obeys the commands wait, sit, stay. I was working with him on leash training. I taught him not to chase our cats in a matter of a day with the use of a squirt bottle. He is very trainable and a lovable dog. He is like velcro with me and undoubtedly has accepted me as pack leader.

I have noticed several dominance qualities. He butts his head in my lap when he wants petted. He claws you with his paw to get more petting. He is very resistent to laying down and will stare at you a bit before he ducks his head and lays down. Knowing this, I have in the matter of a few days, had him responding very well to me as his leader. He is a bit more resistent to my husband who is a little more tentative than I am. I have been fostering a relationship with the dog and my 4 and 8 yr old daughters by having them feed him and give him treats after he does a command. He seems to be accepting of this and obeys them.

HOWEVER: last night my 22 month old son did something to the dog and I heard a low slightly drawn out growl. I was about 6 feet away from them and not sure what my son did but I think the dog was laying down and my son probably leaned his head down to rest on the dog's shoulder or side. I was so taken aback for this that I first asked my 4 yr old if it was her who made the sound. She said, no, it was Jet . My son in the meantime had walked away so there was no imposing threat. This was not the first time my son had touched the dog or even leaned on him. I do not encourage this and I have been working with my son too to tell him, pet the dog, not lay or be gentle. My son has not been abusive to Jet nor have I let him pester him.

I am beside myself with worry and fear that this dog will hurt my child or if not mine, other kids who frequent my home. I know I could work throught this training issue with time. I have a pretty extensive background with dogs and know that most problems are fixable. I have brought babies home to dogs but not dogs home to babies. I think Jet would co exist just fine with the toddler as long as he didn't do anything or try to take anything from him. Most of the time, my son does ignore the dog except for running his hand over him when he passes by. Jet has been fine with that, not even reacting in most cases.

Question to you all - is this dog a time bomb? Can you ever trust a dog again once they have growled at a person? Does he deserve the trust? How fixable it it and how intense is the problem in this context?

If I decide against keeping Jet, he will go back to the groomer to live a comfortable happy life. He will not be an outside dog again so I have the comfort of that. What would you do if you were me?

Answer 1

Whoa, whoa, whoa. Slow down just a minute. First of all, if you're simply uncomfortable with the dog, then give him to the groomer.



However, I think you're racing ahead here. What seemed to happen is that the boy went to go lean against the dog and, since the dog wasn't really feeling that (was most likely dozing), gave a small grumble. Just like a "Hey, leave me alone." thing. Growling does not mean aggression in the slightest and, to be honest, if I were you I would have been THRILLED that the dog has enough bite inhibition and NONaggressive tendencies to just grumble. Are you quite sure it was even a growl? My dogs sometimes give long, drawn out sighs and they sound like they're growling but aren't.



I don't think he's a ticking time bomb. I think he's a wonderfully restrained animal. I don't think you need to have visions of attacks swimming in your head.



However, like I said, if you just aren't comfortable with it, give him to the other person for a good life. Or talk to a professional behaviorist (try one of them first, before a trainer, and DEFINITELY someone I would trust instead of us yahoos - no pun intended - here!) and have her evaluate Jet and see what she thinks. In the meantime, really research the breed. You're lucky - you have a purebred rescue, so it's simple to look up the personality of the English Setter.



It's just not something I would really worry about yet, nor is it something I would "correct" him for. It's a warning and if you teach him that he shouldn't do that, he may just go for an air snap - or worse. But definitely work on making sure Jet knows that even baby is above him.

Answer 2

Firstly i have to clear up the fact that you seem it is only 'bull' breeds that are dog aggressive and attack guide/assistant dogs WELL clearly darling you haven't been out the house in a while because its certainly not just bull breeds that are aggressive (have you ever researched golden retriever attacks?). I have 8 dogs (2 of them happen to be Staffordshire BULL Terriers and 2 are Staffordshire BULL Terrier crosses) I have never had a problem with them being dog/human or animal aggressive so please don't plaster the whole breed red just because a few have dog aggression. People who have dog aggressive dogs should take the correct precautions such as muzzling, extensive training and knowledge of how to handel their dog, they should also carry round a break stick with them so they can minimise any attacks if the dog manages to get lose out of the muzzle. Some people actually don't know their dog is aggressive, what if they have just rescued it from the pound and the dog was assessed but they didn't find any aggression then the dog was re homed and suddenly became aggressive? Saying 'oh my dog is only dog aggressive' is an acceptable form of behaviour, what do you expect people to do? damn their dogs to hell because they happen to not like other dogs? abuse them, kill them abandon them WHAT? i would rather keep a dog aggressive dog than it be euthanized. Surely you would as well if you where a dog lover? I think yes its the owners fault at times but not always if you know for sure your dog is dog aggressive then sure take the safety measures but if you don't know then there is no way to prevent what will happen! EVERY dog bites not just bully breeds so i think you should remember that next time you go for a rant like this!!! If you read into a true bully breed you will know that if socialised (the SAME AS ANY DOG) they WILL be good with other animals.

Answer 3

I really liked sassy shibas answer. I thought: Finally a dog person answering a question not some idiot that has no clue or some show person that only knows Goldens or something.



Growling is a warning. Some dogs will growl at children and puppies and NEVER bite. Its not really a bad sign. however, you should monitor the child better. This is one of the big issues with getting a rescue rather than a pup from a good breeder.

Also, I have a female dobe that used to groan a lot. I reacted very strongly to it for about the first year. It sounded like a growl. So its quite possible that is what you heard.

I would check the dog myself. get down on the floor. Mess with his paws and ears, pinch him, harass him, hug him, restrain him and see how he reacts. Better you get bit than your kid, so do anything you can think of that your kids might do to him. You really should have already done this before allowing your young children near him. You need to see what his threshold is. If he growls at you, then you have an issue. Personally, it may be nothing, but rescues really aren't worth the risk when young children are involved. Getting a puppy from a good breeder is really the only smart thing to do when you have small children.

Answer 4

Big question: is he fixed? A lot of times an unfixed male will display alot of these dominance issues, including the growling.

My mothers male German Short Haired Pointer does the same thing, and I really must say, I am often a little afraid of him. I'm five ten and healthy as a horse, I'm also trained to defend myself from an aggressive dog, but he's ninety pounds. It's not often that e growls and we're on him when ever he displays this attitude. However, it is always unnerving.

I would never leave your child alone with him, I'd be terrified of what would happen if he fell on Jet by accident. Would the dog growl or snap? If he hasn't been aggressive before and you are with him and you child at all times I think it might be worth working with Jet some more. He seems like anincrediblyy smart dog.

I'd also start taking him to dog trainingclassess. He sounds well trained so definitely a higher up course. This will not only help further his education andvieww of you as pack leader, but it will get him necessary socialization. I think all of these will be required to break thisdominancee streak of his.

Honestly I think it is a matter of howattachedd to Jet are you right now? The longer you wait the more attached to him you will be.

Best of Luck!

Answer 5

If he was tied up outside most of his life, it's lack of socilization and a professional trainer could probably help you out there. For an under socialized dog, especially one that probably has never been socialized with children, I'd just make sure to never leave them alone with the dog.



Just an FYI, the putting his head in your lap and pawing you for attention is not dominance related. It's just him being pushy and wanting your attention NOW. The best thing to do for that is ignore it. I know it's hard, my Aussie does this too, but it's the only way as anything else is giving them what they want, attention. Even if it's negative attention, it's still attention.



Yes, you can trust a dog once they've growled at a person. My dogs growl at people they don't know that scare them. I correct them right away, but they don't go attacking the next person that scares them and people can still come into my home with no problem. My Shepherd mix has bitten me while going after another dog and that's all, he hasn't bitten me for taking anything away from him, leaning over him, hugging him, petting him, hasn't even growled.



But, if you're not comfortable with him around your children, then you should probably give him back to the groomer and let her know why so she knows to be on the look out if she ever has kids around. If you really want to try to keep him, try the trainer route first and go from there.

Answer 6

Did Jet have a toy or food at the time? Maybe the baby accidentally pulled the dogs hair? There is a lot of reasons he could have growled. I would be very cautious with the baby around the dog for now. Jet has to realize that the baby is alpha to him as well. I wouldn't let the baby on the floor near the dog unattended. Jet could be jealous of the attention that the baby is getting. When Jet around try and keep the baby up higher than him...(ie on the couch or in your arms). Usually pack leaders will be in a higher position. Small children can accidentally pull the dogs ears, or hurt them slightly and the dog can snap without notice. Keep them separated until the baby is older and knows how to approach the dog. I wouldn't get rid of him right yet.



Also, when he puts his head in your lap.. Push him away and ignore him. Pet him and play with him on your terms only.



Good Luck!

Answer 7

The question you need answered is MUCH to serious and important to ask the people at Y!A. We're not dog trainers. You need to discuss this with your vet and a good dog behaviorist.



I think you could probably deal with the situation and keep the dog, but you need to strengthen the alpha pack leadership and the dog's place in the pack below ALL the humans.



You also need to get a tighter rein on this child. The dog sounds like it was complaining, not planning to attack. Still, as pack leader, you have the right to enforce that this is not an allowed action towards your child on the dog's part. If you can't control your child's interactions with the dog, you might need to get rid of the dog in order to keep the child safe.



You need to talk to the groomer, if the groomer knows this breed well.

You need to talk to an experienced breeder of this breed.



You need to learn all you can about the breed traits and needs of the breed. This dog needs a specific level of exercise to be a happy family member. I suspect his breed needs to be an outside dog who can run and play. He'd probably do well with agility training or some other high energy exercise.



You need to discuss this with your vet as the vet is more likely to know breed traits and hopefully will know if you have a GOOD dog behaviorist in your area.



Below are some websites that might help you learn how to be a stronger pack leader with your dog.



On the feeding, you can reinforce things by YOU filling the dog's dish with food and leaning over and pretending to eat some of the food. Then you give it to the child who will feed the dog and have the child pretend to eat some of the food. Then the child puts the dish down for the dog. This reinforces both YOU =AND= the child as alpha to the dog.



Just because he's velcroed to you doesn't prove you are alpha to the dog. If he is overprotective of you, he's a risk to others who might wish to be around you.



In a stare-down, he who turns his head away first, loses! -!-

Answer 8

"Let a sleeping dog lie." Put Jet's bed somewhere he can go to be alone, and teach your son that when Jet is asleep, he shouldn't bother him. I've heard of a lot of dogs who are grumpy if woken up when they're super tired. My own dog has even growled at me a few times when I've woken him up on accident (though he never bit me).



It doesn't necessarily mean that Jet has an aggression problem. But keep supervising when your son and Jet are together, just to be sure there is no room for accidents to happen.

Answer 9

He needs to know who is the pack leader of the household. He cannot be allowed to show any dominance towards anybody. I think that Jet should go into some classes. A professional can assess how dominant that Jet is and find out if Jet is aggressive. He can tell you any concerns he has and give you the best advice. I, myself, wouldn't keep Jet because I wouldn't want him to attack anybody for some odd unknown reason. That dog was not properly socialized. He probably could be "fixed" but it will cost a lot of money and take time. Trust your instincts and go with it. If Jet isn't working out, you can always adopt a different dog. A puppy would be ideal.

Answer 10

Time bomb? Probably not.



With dogs that are kept outdoors for the majority of their lives, you see that they are socially crippled. They don't understand human connections like other dogs do.



This is a dog who will require intensive training and socialization to reform him into a domestically suited pet.



He's dominant, yes, but it more or less stems from a world where he was his own master, void of human contact or guidance, a dog will do what a dog wants to do.



Seek a behaviorist before seeking a trainer.